In an effort to promote economic recovery, President Obama is proposing tax relief to encourage small business spending. He also wants to spur job growth by investing millions in America's infrastructure. If his plan makes it past congress, will it be the boost the US needs?
Loading ...Also, let us know what, if any impact on the market his proposal will make should it pass.
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Everytime I post something negitive about democrats, or Obama , the INO mgmt suppresses the posts.
Lets see
SMALL BUSINESS LOAN - not good
you know why ?
I am a small business, and you need to have steller credit and 3 years of profits, on the business books
in order to get the loan - and anyone who has run a business - like the president ... oh wait - he hasnt
knows that you dont run super profits , you pass the costs along...
anyway - too much to write, bottom line - no , and get the clown out of the high office.
Thank you for your research, either way, we could had had him and save a lot of grief and loss of life. but, he was more concerned with his little friend and playing cigar games instead. You failed to comment on his constant lying to the public and family. Thanks to him, oral sex is not sex? He was morally absent, and poor role model for our young people. I find a similarity with Obozo and other agree, please note, you are in a definite minority based on the results of this poll. i have voted for those over the years i feel are best for the country, however, i must admit, i have been disappointed by most of my choices. My average is probably 50/50 between the 2 parties. However, i did not need someone else to tell me who to vote for, or swayed by a simple slogan that a 2 year old could remember and cite as why, they voted. . Example:( change.) one word, understandable, remembered by most after 5 minutes. I believe, unfortunately, a large majority of voters make their choice as directed by others regardless of weather that party has the self interest of our country, occupation, race, etc. Both parties lie, and have used this to misinform the public and manipulate blocks of voters that they represent their interests. Political promises are rarely kept, we know that , and yet we continue to support a party regardless of past history, and worst of all the truth.
@rich:
Actually it was Sudan who offered to turn over bin Laden to Saudi Arabia (not to the US), but the Saudis did not want him back so the deal fell through. Here is an article about it from a legitimate news source.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/ac2/wp-dyn/A61251-2001Oct2?language=printer
Clinton did not give a "pass" to terrorists despite what the Republican propaganda machine would have us believe. In fact the budget on anti-terror activities increased by 3-fold under Clinton's administration to about $6.7 Billion.
http://www.snopes.com/rumors/clinton.asp
Our infrastructure is crumbling and without maintenance and upgrading our nation will crumble also. Just ask the people of San Bruno.
yes possible as he is indirectly creating more jobs opportunity to their people.Once the people has got the job,spending power in US will be stronger.So indirectly the GDP spending and consumer confident might also improve and will be more optimistic.Thus the US economic might also improve from there.Good Mr Obama...
obama is an idiot...... he has NO fiscal experience what so ever...
I just do not believe that 4% more in taxes after my first 200K or 250K is going to mean ""will not grow". I have run several small businesses with less than 100 employees and it just isn't so... I can not think Of a single time I ever decided not to "gro" because of a 4% increase in taxes AFTER my forst 250K... this is just too negative... do I think its going to be a bed of roses??? No way. But we will come back and travel the roads and people will create/have jobs.
Look for the article: The Automatic Earth: September 10 2010: No economic growth for years to come
your are correct about the surplus collected by Clinton. guess we were being taxed more than we needed to be. We were promised a reduction in taxes, and i voted for him, he lied. As a matter of fact he lied a lot. and he was impeached. That has only happened two time in our country's history. In the private sector it is called a racket, and you would be in jail with other gangsters and thieves. during his time we saved money by ignoring and giving a pass to terrorists, which in the future years cost much more defending ourselves from that threat, in American lives lost here and abroad. The public demanded action after 9/11/2001. Congress determines what and how much homeland security would be spent. Saudi Arabia captured Ben Ladden and offered him to Clinton (no charge). So he went on his merry way and made his evil plans. and carried them out. I did not vote for him the next time. you did. Do you want more facts about your man?
PLEASE CONSIDER........
Noting several insightful comments re what the PERCEIVED mood is in the Market, yes I agree. Like so many things, it's not what is actually happening, rather than what is PERCEIVED to be happening.
However, we must also be aware that what is perceived, in this Multi-Media age of the Holy Spin Doctor, is MOSTLY Emotion and not necessarily TRUTH. Indeed, in recent decades, we have been indoctrinated, by Media & Govt Spinners, into accepting Perceptions as automatically being the Truth........
"If it's on TV, or in the Paper, it MUST be true! They would, couldn't, print lies or they would be sued !" mentality. Ha Ha !
When was the last time a Political Party or Govt ever sued the Media for slander, libel or plain old lies ???? They cannot afford to take on the very few Media Orgs that dominate most of the World's Media - TV, Radio, Newspapers, Magazines.
RUPERT MURDOCH
How about the best "thing" Australia ever exported to the World - Rupert Murdoch ???? We were glad to be rid of him, but he still makes and breaks Govts over here. Not that he would ever be able to fool our more astute UK and US cousins, or control their Govts, I am sure. LOL
Too many people are swayed by their favourite Media Personality or Writer - who appeal to their own "religiously-held" belief systems, based on personal and political bias which, in turn, is based on upbringing, family, education and experience - none of which are infallible.
People, including Murdoch's readers mostly only see/hear/read what they want to see/hear/read, based on their belief systems. Most are "products" of their own backgrounds and entrenched biases & prejudices. Rupert is a Media Master because he knows how to play ordinary hard working people. Murdoch doesn't own most the world's media through chance, personality or intellect. He does it by deception and half-truth - rat-cunning.
He knows how to pick the scabs covering people's biases and prejudices. He knows most ordinary people are resistant to change, not all that adventurous, conservative and more interested in maintaining the status quo in their lives. He knows most Corporations, like his, are interested most in Power, Influence, Prestige and Monopoly. He plays to them a different tune, but it is still the same old game as with us more common folk.
Like his father before him, and other Media Moguls, he wheels & deal, and tells people what they (the Media Moguls) & their Political mates want them to hear. The Fourth Estate is Bankrupt. Those with Integrity, Honour and Truth branded on their foreheads are either dead and gone, broke or unable to earn a decent living through their profession.
We are as much to blame for this sad State as the Media Moguls and Politicians, because we neither search the facts diligently enough, nor do we sufficiently apply the almost lost skill of critical listening, thinking and reading.
"Seeking Honour, Truth, Integrity and Humility are all but Dead, but long may they Reign."
Lots of the usual US paranoia about taxes. Why aren't you guys as passionately opposed to handouts (subsidies) to industry in the form of tax breaks? That is a form of indirect taxation, no? You can't cry about social medical costs while not protesting corporate welfare. Look at the costs to the US taxpayer of the recent corporate bailouts, and compare that to the expected costs of medical care, etc. Surely subsidies run counter to free market ideals?
Do you really think it is better to pump $trillions into Wall Street than into a more just health and welfare system? I cannot believe I saw protestors' placards with "Keep the Govt out of our Medicare".
It's a pity you don't stop building cars and roads and retool to make rail track, locomotives and windmills instead. The US has the largest coastline of any nation. It therefore has the largest off shore acreage to exploit for wind, and wave.
Your internal aviation industry is screwed. Fuel prices, emissions standards and cathartic management will make it worse. Passenger/ commmuter rail travel, properly organised, is competitive with air travel on a transit time basis up to maybe 500 miles. Since less energy and CO2 is required to move a person on a train than in a plane (except for very high speed trains), that should translate into cheaper train tickets. Rail freight would also help. Trucking companies could re-organise to put stuff onto rail at the beginning, then take it off at the end for the last leg. That would cut down on fuel use and CO2 emissions while reducing road congestion and therefore wear and tear on roads and so the costs of maintenance. Imagine if Wal-Mart reorganised on those lines?
If GM could make tanks, they could make locomotives and windmills.
If your government cut the annual $50 billion or so in tax breaks to the oil industry, maybe there would be a more level playing field and the renewables sector would stop looking so expensive, and FITs would be needed less.
Your and my taxes are NOT going to go up, they are already up! And there is already thousands of "hidden" taxes; some are called fees or licenses (existing ones are increaseing) and a myrid (= tons of) others are coming. Remember, NO business pays fees or taxes; eventually those costs pass to the end buyer. We can not afford any more "free" goverment stuff.
@Red Talon et al ...Don't you see, all of you whether you are Republican or Democrat, who is really running the country and who is running Obama, George Bush, Clinton and going as far back as 200 years ago or more? It is the corporations, ie., big mega business. It is more obvious now than it has ever been because now they have more money than ever before. It is so obvious that the party system was set up to make us peasants think we were really voting for one party or the other. Did you see the Obama roast before he was elected and how John McCain as much as ceded to Obama? I had never seen that before. Usually both parties fight to the bitter end but not this time. McCain gave up months before. Why? Because it was all a big game. McCain knew Obama would win because it was predetermined by the powers that be ..the ones who pull the strings, ie., big mega business. When you see how evil mega business is, you have to ask who are the people behind mega business. How could they be so evil? Digging further, you will find, they are the "elite" and further still you find the "elite" are almost all, if not all, Satanists. I hate using the word 'elite' for these evil people. It is too nice for them and implies that they are somehow special. So who controls the Satanists? Satan, of course! When you see this, it all begins to make sense. Satan is the most EVIL of all evil and the stupid "elite" have sold their souls to him. Satan can be beaten using the name of Jesus against him and his demons but many Americans don't want to turn to God. I guess that's why they have the ACLU. Maybe when things get really bad they will see where their salvation lies. As nb said, "God help us all. God help us please." I would like to add, "In Jesus' name".
i think Obama is doing the right things at d moment... i really appreciate his move to ban outsourcing to outside nations.. it will create a market space for technical jobs as well as computer, software sector. If the country lacks its own skilled labour for the job. Outsider would come over there to work for the companies and consequently money coming for the nation...!! hope this will do good for the country if corporate world supports these moves in return for cut in taxes..!!
We don't need more supply side stimulus that gives businesses more money to spend, if they choose to. We need more direct demand side stimulus and the supply will take care of itself. Have a tax holiday where withholdings are reduced so the money goes directly to the people. The multiplier effect will kick in as people spend the extra money and then businesses will have a reason to hire more people and buy more equipment, etc. And, by no means should the current tax cuts be eliminated because that would take back the money made available through the withholding reductions. In the short-term, federal deficits would increase but before long, with more workers paying taxes, the tax revenues would begin to increase. Finally, put a lid on government spending; in fact, cut back just like businesses have had to do.
@rich broiling: You've done a great job of completely ignoring the facts which most Republicans seem to excel at.
Your argument that the recession began when Obama got the nomination makes absolutely no sense. The guy wasn't even in office. Only a Republican could find a way to blame the Dems for the damage to the economy when it was their guy in office when all the damage was done. To anyone with any sense and logic it is apparent that Bush Jr. and his cronies destroyed an economy that was working like a well oiled machine. If you bothered to look at the link in my post above you would see this. If you want to blame anyone you should be blaming Bush, but then you would have to accept the fact that you voted for an idiot.
As I said in my earlier post the S&P is up over 60% in the last year and a half. That's when Obama took office, but I'm sure you have found a way to give the credit for that to the Republicans.
The bottom line is this. The Democrats policies favor the poor and middle class which comprises about 90% of the US population. The Republicans policies favor the upper class and wealthy which only comprise about 10% of the population. When the majority (middle class) of the population is employed and prospering they are spending money which fuels the economy which in turn fuels the markets. Then everyone, including the wealthy prosper. This was never more apparent than it was during the Clinton administration.
Imagine what bad shape you would be in if Bush had got his way with Social Security. Then your SS account would have gotten hit as bad as your 401K or other investment accounts.
To all of you anti-Obamites: Stop listening to the kooks on Fox News Network and start getting the facts.
I will keep coming back to this.... It should be very clear to everyone that at every level of our government, economic, financial, and monetary systems we have total corruption and complete fraud. So much so that all is in fact lost. The very fraudsters that caused this crisis are in control of the currency as well, and that currency is most certainly bankrupt. Gold and silver are the only defense, as well as plenty of items for self sufficiency. All this talk here about we should do this and we should do that. The rubicon has been crossed now and we now live in a banana republic. Look up the definition of a banana republic just for your own re-education on this. I have a passport and am seriously considering leaving for good. I can't take it anymore. Just understand one thing.... This will all eventually lead to you having to make a decision on whether a microchip implant will be under your skin or not. We must all become aware that fascism can happen here. God help us all. God help us please. Please end this nightmare.
Promises. promises, i m still waiting for Clinton's middle class tax cut. I would like to respond, but, it would be censored. Our only hope is he is impeached as the first order of business of the new congress. I am 85 years young, and thought i had seen everything in the way of politics, this guy takes the cake! For you chartists, draw a 200 day average vs a 50 day average on any major index you like, the crossover is the exact day obozo locked in the nomination, early june 2007, i think the 7th. The market tanked some 200 points the next day and has dropped to its present low, and it wouldn't rise till he is gone! If you voted for him and lost money, you got what you deserved. Pity those, that lost most of their savings for retirement, thats on you and your children. I am suffering now at 85 because some of you were so stupid. Thanks a heap!
Totally agree!! Unfortunately I don't see it get done this way...
The newly proposed stimulus is just to buy more union votes for the coming election -- hope American people will open their eyes and minds to see what it's truly for.
Even in the Soviet Union after successive failures they used to break out a little capitalism to spur on the farmers (if only to avoid starvation.) This maneuver echoes this. Once the crisis passes as the capitalism produces benefits, out will come the long knives and it'll be back to Keynesian/socialist madness.
Unless all the economists at the Conference Board and elsewhere are wrong then the economy seems to be doing pretty darn well. Especially considering we were on the brink of an economic disaster just a couple of years ago thanks to the epic failure of yet another Republican. Take a look at the chart here.
http://www.conference-board.org/pdf_free/economics/bci/dswingle.pdf
It clearly shows that the economy is on the rise. And has everyone forgotten that the S&P 500 is up over 60% in the last year and a half. Do you you think you get that kind of market growth without growth in the economy?
And what do I mean by another Republican "epic failure"? Lets see now...
In 1986 Reagan's budget deficit grew to a record of over $200 billion.
Not to be outdone Bush Sr's budget deficit topped out at $290 billion in 1992. But Bush Jr was determined to beat them all. In his last year in office the estimated deficit was $1.3 Trillion.
Now do you really think that a debacle of this magnitude is going to disappear in a matter of a couple of years? Of course not. It's going to take much longer, but we are on the right path now that we have a man of intelligence in the Whitehouse and not a flunky like Bush.
Here are the facts if anyone would care to enlighten themselves. Keep in mind that the graph does not take into account the final deficit of $1.3 Trillion, only the $400 Billion that was projected at the time. If the graph was updated to include the $1.3 trillion it would have to be 3 times longer.
http://ibew.org/articles/08daily/0807/080714_justthefacts.htm
By-the-way, notice that in every year of Clinton's administration the deficit became smaller and smaller, while unemployment became less and less, until the last year of his administration when we had a $225 Billion SURPLUS and a 3.8% unemployment rate. Bush managed to wipe out half that surplus in just his first year in office.
When all is said and done Obama will produce results similar to Clinton, simply because Democratic policies are more favorable to the economy. Republican's and their supply-side policies are doomed to failure as recent history proves.
The cost of financing the project, i.e. issuing more Federal Debt vs. the expected return on the project exceeds the return. Therefore the initiative cannot work. Such initiatives only when the return is greater than the cost. The cost of financing deficits compounds exponetially while the return on the investment is limited.
There are ways to deal with the US economy but it would takes guts ...lots of guts. First, government should take back the bank that they gave away almost 100 years ago ..or actually was stolen from us. If the US has to pay interest on loans, then let's pay the interest to ourselves, ie., the US's bank which is owned by all of us.
Next, the gov't needs to strictly begin adhering to the Constitution.
Then they should reduce government to half the people that are now in it.
Get rid of the IRS.
If there has to be tax it should only be allowed on goods sold, not both the income and the goods tax. I know people don't want to see the tax everyday but the cost of administering taxes on goods sold would cost the people far less while giving the government the money needed to run it. Remember government would be reduced by half.
Do NOT allow the government to charge both taxes because once they institute any of them, they will not let go of it.
Then the government needs to start backing money with gold or other metals. This could be done slowly if necessary, not all at once ..but there has to be a start somewhere.
What would happen to politicians and the president who did this? They would probably be assassinated.
If something is impossible, this is it but there must be a way to avoid this from happening.
Most of these tough decisions would affect all of us but it would serve us right for not taking a hard line years ago. Most of us were so lazy, we couldn't even be bothered to write one letter. Today you cannot send a regular letter because any closed envelopes, especially those written in your own hand, are shredded unopened due to the anthrax scare after 9/11. So send a postcard. Or an email. Phone your representatives NOT when you want the government to do something for you but when you educate the politicians.
Your actions in this area, no matter how feeble, DO MAKE A DIFFERENCE. And for goodness sake, don't swear at them. Remember ONE deranged woman took prayers out of school single-handedly. YOUR ACTIONS DO MAKE A DIFFERENCE.
What will be hidden in the many thousands of pages of this bill and when will we really know what's in it? Businesses and lenders want a predictable atmosphere to operate their functions. Right now we have uncertainty. Hope & change? More like smoke and mirrors.
Many of the jobs shed over the last two years will never return. Particularly in manufacturing agriculture and construction. Mechanization has reduced human labor progressively over the last century and will continue. One laborer and a machine will do what 10 people used to do. Robotics and other sophisticated machinery will continue to reduce human labor. The motivation of increased labor cost (health care, taxes, safety, workers comp, etc.) and increased machinery reliability drives business to reduce labor in most functions.
The business owner or CEO has incentive to have his/her operation more efficient and cost less. Not so with governmental and quasi governmental managers. The school administrator has no incentive to reduce teachers or staff. The bureaucrat has no incentive to reduce his/her section staff. A reduction can be imposed via budget cuts but there is no incentive for improved efficiency or lowering cost.
Businesses will be less likely to hire new employees when demand rises if they know or believe the reason for the rise in demand is based on short term stimulus. We need long term structural change that reduces cost or otherwise improves competitive positioning to really stimulate job growth. If the government really focused on doing that rather than trying to figure out new ways of raising tax revenues to cover a lot of inefficient and unnecessary spending, they would at least be moving in the right direction, in my opinion.
It was his Grandfather who served in WW11. Get your facts straight.
The president reminds me of my negotiations with a new car salesman. While you are at the dealership it all sounds good, but when you get home you realize you just paid too much. There was a response to a quote that went around in the summer of 2008 during the presidential campaign that went, "If you put lipstick on a pig, you still have a pig". I think a lot of what has happened in the last two years is nothing more than "lipstick".
This is just another hidden ploy to take tax dollars out of the pockets of the taxpayers and transfer to the union pockets (eg more votes for Obama). This spending has to stop until we are on a more sound footing.
Finally, the first step in the right direction.
"In a speech on Wednesday in Cleveland, Obama will ask Congress to let businesses quickly write off 100 percent of their spending on new plants and equipment through 2011."
There's a significant pessimism... and your survey shows it clearly. The government can appear to be "lame" however, the private sector can create and sustain jobs much better than any federal stimulus. It's like taking money from the left hand to give it to the right hand... futile after a while.
We will see the market and economy pick up before the Election as it normally does, but the long affect will be negitive.
Labour for infrastructure will be low to semi skilled, not specialists and will therefore not bring growth and increase productivity and will not lift GDP. Will be good for gold.
AS Obama calls the majority of Americans or conservatives the NO people!
Well I say No more spending the money that our children's children will make in the future!
Obama says yes we can! I say NO he can't! Come November lets make him a lame duck president! I don't know about you but I am tired of all the liars and deceivers in D.C., doesn't matter which party they are in! Something has got to change and the sooner the better! State and local governments are just as bad, I liken them to drug addicts and their drug of choice is the peoples money, the more they get the more the want!
In all my 61 years I have not seen anything like what is going on in America today,it's like I'm having a nightmare, it blows me away! Well if God be with us, who can be against us?
This is a two part question, so it's unfair to ask as a single yes/no question. First of all, I think the economy needs tax cuts, especially to small and medium sized businesses. Tax cuts have been shown to consistently stimulate the economy. Also, the health bill is going to kill or seriously cripple small businesses, so it needs to be repealed. There is infrastructure that needs to be taken care of, but maybe a caveat is that only non-union businesses be allowed to bid on them. That way, a lot of the stimulus money won't be wasted by going into union pockets. Preferably, infrastructure would be taken care of only as money becomes available, and only to repair, not to build new. I would also promote a bill that would have legislators working without pay if they can't pass a balanced budget on time. The balanced budget idea should apply to all states, and to the federal government. And no retroactive pay once a budget is passed. Not having a balanced budget passed on time is a serious waster of money.
The only political way out for America is to print more money. More pieces of paper money will be needed to buy essential commodities. The only safe haven when ALL politicians world over pander to voters and Govt employees demand for higher wages is to put your savings into essential commodities to protect the paper value. The rest of the world will play follow my leader.
I agree with you that at some point, the substantial debts would prevent the government to intervene effectively into the free economy. The Japan lesson is often mentioned when people try to prove that government intervention often makes matter worse. However, at this point, I think the government can take advantage of lowing yield. Right now, consumer spending is still low, we still need government supports in order for the economy to run.
Agree with others that Obama's plans would help the economy in some ways. Talking about the efficiency of his plans, I agree with Todd and Clint that spending on infrastructure would have long term impact and benefit. Any money would help the economy moving forward. However, it seems like we are still debating about which is the best way to use that money.
More spending on anything will just make matters worse. More tax breaks for business; especially
small business is what is needed: It's what works, and always has worked every
time it's tried. Dollar for dollar, someone has calculated that it is four to six times more
effective than fed "stimulus" spending. Whom do you think can determine the wisest use of these
funds; the independent business man, or a federal bureaucrat/politician.
This is a fundamental that apparently the dems.or especially the progressives cannot, or
refuse to understand,
let's try it and see if it works as I think it will help. Jobs are generated by small business owners, especially as they grow. More people working=more $ in circulation=greater need for goods and services.
Yes it will. Though a little too late in the day. The Singapore model of success was (and still is) to avoid large businesses, instead promoting small businesses. Big business was discouraged and penalised for competing and hurting small businesses. The result was a 1% yes one percent unemployment rate and the side benefit was that the Government was never at the beck and call of large corporations for bailouts, handouts and the like. Stupid "new World Order". Now we all have to pay.! Focus on money and you breed greed, focus on humanity and you breed community.
Now Doug seems to know whathe is talking about & I will go along with that.
Why do we need this stimulus? Didn't we just have the summer of recovery? By my accounts the summer is over so the finacial crisis must be over. Hail to the Chief!
I agree with Clint. What is meant by 'Infrastructure' is important. Water and sewer lines are really needed in many parts of the country, most are very old, and local & state economies are unable to provide the upgrade they need.
I have heard and read many detractors damn the use of $700 Billion to bail out the big banks. It probably was too illegal to let them fail, and replace them with federally owned banks. It probably is not wise to allow government to invest in competition with private interprise. I like that the debts have been mostly paid with interest. I am more dubious about AGI and GM. I wonder if the benefit exceeds the risk, but I am not a CPA or an economist.
I suspect the major failure of the Obama administration is in the field of public relations. Everybody makes mistakes in every field. Most people don't seem to understand the choices he has to make.
'Judge a man by the enemies he makes" is an old saying. Many of the critics of the administration and the president are being judged by their choice of enemies. That is a boost to their egos.
I wouldn't have Obama's job as a gift! I look forward to having new blood in the house & senate. The old members tend to vote their own agenda instead of the majority of their constituents'.
W. GERALD FOWLER, M.D.
Wether it helps or not is moot. The point is no one here thinks it will. And if this impression is wide spread not only will it not help the economy it won't help him get elected. Not only will Obama not get elected but more than likely there will be opportunistic political forces attempting to take advantage of national disillusionment. These force may not have major party ties. Should a charismatic leader with no party or commercial alliances emerge, at some time in the future all bets may be off.
Interesting comments, very cogent points.
However, no one seems to have mentioned the USA's economy haemoraging Trillions in Defence & Overseas Military spending ??? Surely the ongoing war in the Middle East has been the US's single largest Economic disaster, create by G W Bush? And then, we could go back even further, to the US's military expeditions into so many foreign conflicts. They sure fuelled growth and employment in Defence Suppliers, but where has the money gone?
Same place as Wall Street, I would guess. Obama has only as much power as Congress and Wall St allow him, as already suggested by several other respondents. Then we have the Zionist interests that control Congress and, by default, the US Economy and Military, as well as sitting on the Boards of so many US Corporations.
Not to mention Alan Greenspan's new job advising and helping create a "new bubble" for one of the men primarily responsible for the last "bubble." Eeeek !
To me, the problem seems a lot wider, and endemic than just the Obama Administration - he may well be making things worse in some respects, but most of his problems were inherited from a disastrous Bush Administration.
Here in the Land Down-Under, Fed Govt Stimulus did actually work, helping us come through the GFC relatively unscathed, but this was under-pinned my a massive mining boom.
I think there is valid argument for borrowing on Nation-Building Infrastructure, keeping people in work and developing for future generations. However, when that borrowing goes way beyond a nation's ability to repay, especially when it is already in way over it's head, like the US, it certainly looks like a recipe for more disaster. Thank God FDR did this in the 1930's, or the rest of the world would have succumbed to Fascism.
Obama should just keep his big nose out of the private sector and focus on
cutting the budget, eliminating wasteful gov't jobs, subsidies, spending, etc.
The U.S. is absolutely capable of recovering if the administration would consider
cutting taxes, repealing the health care bill, letting go of the obscene idea of
green energy, ie: cap and tax, approve more oil drilling, deport illegals, secure
our borders, promote manufacturing and private enterprise. Our infrastructure does
need repair, although, once the projects are complete, there are no more jobs.
Even so, infrastructure jobs are skilled jobs for the most part, which means
only a small percentage of the unemployed would be eligible for the positions,
whereas an even smaller amount of the unemployed would be useful for the general
labor positions. OBMAMA'S personal agenda has absolutely nothing to do with bringing
America back on her feet. I consider him the great "Appeaser"!
Obama wouldn't know what to do if it hit him in the face.
Just a another tax-and-spend liberal, Democratic scheme to use OUR money to buy THEM votes.
Another monkey wrench in the wheels of free enterprise.
Democrat walks into a bar and says to the patrons "The drinks are you!".
How quick people judge something they know nothing about. Give us solutions not criticism. To create jobs, there needs to be a greater demand for the procucts or services offered by the companies. They are all inter-related. Worker buys products, company makes more products, as need arises this creates additional jobs to fill the demands for the products. Banks extend credit for companies to buy items required to produce more products. If the products don't sell, companies have to lay off workers etc, etc. Every one is part of this circle of productivity and job creation. Lets find solutions and work together to bring back our economy. Stop the name calling, it does nothing. Americans are strong we can overcome anything.
Being a Scot investing in the US.Look at europe,they are pulling the reins in,maybe they are too late.But at least the see a big big problem ahead and taking big decisions that are really going to hurt us and we know it.Look at the US, what have they done,Print Print and some more printing.Even the dogs in the street can see whats happening.GOD BLESS (HELP)AMERICA
This is no ordinary, run-of-the-mill post WWII recession. We're in uncharted waters here and all we have to go on is economic intelligence. The people in Obama's econoomic advisory group are all very bright and giving this situation a lot of their best thinking. No one said it would be over quickly and that the stimulus would work right away. But they're acting on multiple fronts in an attempt to get things going. Give them some credit. Someone once said "when the going gets tough, the tough get going." So I say stop complaining and blaming and get going and make something happen for yourself.
It's simple, if you want to create more jobs through investing in infraestructure, you need money to pay for that; that money will come from taxes, there is no other way around. The only solution is to create more jobs via private investments which finally will determine a tax break but, not for Joe from Main St, but for the guys who will put the money, among them, Wall St, it’s (unhappily) the only way it will work, and that is because this country was made out of it. You might like it or not, but that is the way it works here.
But, how about cutting spending? Leaving Irak is a good start; how about cutting supporting the big pharmaceuticals through the health reform? Will they let him do it? Does he really want to do it?
Without cutting spending (the commercial gap in this country is on its biggest in decades) we won’t go anywhere but to a hightaxland.
Yes, yes, yes. The sooner the better.
first you need to make money, and then to get credit, not the other way around. obama's plan is like putting the carrot behind the ass (donkey. It is not very far from his economic rescue plans of inflating tires and painting the roofs white. Money on infrastructure has to come from somewhere (taxes or more $ printing) how does this increse unemployment. all what it will do is increase the size of the governme4nt to administer another "what"?
How can our economy improve when most of the jobs are in China?
There will be some stimulus, but at a high cost. Like most government spending, it will be inefficient. We do need some improvements in our infrastructure, but that should have been done with the first $700+ billion stimulus program, which still hasn't been fully spent. Why not use some of that money? Our federal debt is outrageously large, and must be reduced soon or we won't be able to fund the commitments already made to our seniors, much less defend this country against those who threaten our freedoms.
David Rosenberg has an excellent article out today on this topic. A couple of quotes from this article "...aren’t businesses sitting on a record cash hoard right now? In other words, “money” is not an impediment towards business investment growth, say, as much as the regulatory policy backdrop.
This is again one in a long list of quick fixes aimed at boosting domestic spending and is likely to have muted impact, in our view. Even if it does have an impact, it will merely bring forward spending that would have occurred in any event and merely distort the quarterly flow of GDP data much like ‘cash for clunkers’ and the housing tax credits did for the household sector."
"What the U.S. does not need at the current time is a corporate welfare program — providing hundreds of billions of dollars in new taxpayer subsidies to private businesses — at a time of record liquidity on corporate balance sheets, and record peacetime budgetary deficits, is very likely going to fall flat on its face, from both an economic and political vantage point."
In a recently posted YouTube video of a 2007 Obama campaign speech Obama noted that "My father served in WWII and when he came home he got the services he needed."
Hmmm...A quick check reveals his father was born in 1936. Perhaps he served in the Kiddee Commandos? Liar, liar pants on fire?
Will his plan work? Sure, for the banksters and various New World Order insiders.
It will only help his "friends" and will be a dangling carrot double cross to some voters
This is not a serious question.
Throwing money at an economic slowdown meets the law of diminishing returns very quickly. Japan is the most recent example, if you chose to ignor how badly the U.S. did under FDRs spending spree. It took Hitler to get us out of the Great Depression. Japan tried everything in the book to no avail. I fear shovelling money at our recession, given the total lack of business acumen posessed by the current administration, will meet with similar results.
I believe Obama just wants his Democrats elected and this reduction in taxes is a ploy to try to make that happen. I believe Obama is out to destroy the USA from within. I just don't trust him.
The 'NO's' have it. And not by a nose, either.
Far too little and way too late. The faulty policy by Obama's Economic Council that a little stimulus to industry every few months will revive the economy and fool the markets and the people can no longer even lend the appearance of working. The GDP is in decline. The economic policy misjudgment the council has committed during these months is great. It is not in the order of 1-2 GDP growth percentages, but a 7% GDP output gap error. It would take 7% GDP growth to stop the surging unemployment and begin to reduce it.
The conclusion after 20 months in office must be that President's Economic Council is not seriously working to reduce unemployment and stimulate growth, but merely tinkering with little measures that will bring in good PR. Even with the best intentions, the President clearly does not have the economic knowledge and therefore the informed determination to do differently. The same goes for the House and the Senate.
What the government still does not grasp or is not truthfully bothered by, is that the economic crisis of 2008 was no ordinary recession. It was a quadruple whammy brought about by 30 years of malfeasance, incompetence and an ideological detachment from reality. Even with the right policies, recovery might take a decade or more. There are four major factors involved:
1 The underdevelopment of US manufacturing industry over 30 years by starving it of government initiatives and guarantees for capital intensive projects including necessary primary research, resulting in a significant and marked industrial contraction. This was compounded since 1980 by the policy twin of simultaneously shipping out production to China.
2 The massive underfinancing of government finances since 1980 through express government policy and implemented by tax cuts, deficit spending and covering up the holes in the Treasury coffers by borrowing from China and Arabia, resulting in a gigantic national debt, which is now a massive drag on growth and weighing heavily on the government's ability to finance anything. The US has long had one of the lowest tax regimes in the developed world and after 30 years the result is both visibly and tangibly very poor indeed.
3 The US based deregulation and Ayn Rand ayatollahs, free for alls, and diverse financial scumbags succeeded in seriously damaging the global financial system. It is still on life support and not healthy enough to withstand a new contraction, which is now bearing down and right upon us.
Although the total freeze of the global financial system as in early 2009 has been thawed above freezing point through extraordinary measures including many exotic measures never before seen on the planet, the majority of the larger banks are still hiding toxic assets, and a re-freeze can happen at any time. In addition 1500 plus of the 3000 local US banks will now go to the wall through the contraction of the economy.
4 An implosion of the value of US housing which has been one of the major asset types in the US and the greatest repository of US wealth and which was the trigger for the Great Recession as it has been called thus far. The knock on effects are huge, ongoing and burgeoning and mortgage failures will continue until at least Q2 2012 putting ever greater pressure on banks, government and all home owners.
The proposal for tax cuts for businesses and the $50bn infrastructure spending will, if taken together, have a slight but inconsequential effect on the economy.
The tax cuts for business will only have a marginal effect. In very different circumstances this may have been a reasonable policy but these are not normal circumstances. If business are struggling from a drop in demand then having tax cuts to employ another worker may not help at all. Tax cuts will not seriously improve the prospects of business to obtain loans. There are other reasons why banks are not lending to business. To sum up: this policy has been badly designed. It is not sound economic policy but an academic product, and it has clearly been adopted and twisted to fulfil the function of an electioneering soundbite.
Having not acted timeously, correctly and sufficiently in the last 20 months, and evidently having run out of real policy ideas, the government's self-stitched straitjacket is now the following:
Alternative 1
Pass the bill introducing tax cuts for businesses. However, this will not tackle the underlying structural problems in the economy. It will also reduce government revenue and add to the national debt.
Alternative 2
Slash personal income tax across the board, to give the population at large more in their pockets within 8 weeks or so. However that measure would also lower government revenue. Unless the government (federal, state and local government) largely shuts down - and what kind of country would the US then become - a third world anarchy like Mexico? then with unchanged government spending the decrease in government revenue would merely increase the government deficit even more.
The Bush tax rebates of Q1 2008 provided a fleeting halt in economic decline but the GDP effects were washed away in a quarter. They also did nothing to repair the structural faults in the economy. Furthermore, the downside, which is still with us, was an addition to the national debt. If widespread income tax cuts were to be of a permanent nature, the cost of the cuts in the first few years, even if a government did implement successful growth policies, would be a noticeable added burden on the national debt.
In both cases tax cuts would mean that the additional government deficit will have to be covered by borrowing from abroad. This credit from abroad will be added to the national debt. Therefore, tax cuts of any sort will just kick the can down the road and result in a greater national debt and a greater brake on the economy.
The tax-cuts of both kinds therefore appear to have little to do with repairing the US economy and everything to do with electioneering. They provide a propaganda tool for either side to fight the election with, and mean that whichever party gets control of the House and the Senate this November does not have worry about repairing the US economy for at least another 2 years, and can spend a lot of time on filibustering, posturing and gridlock.
The political process needs to be reformed. It is clear that even in serious, even dire situations, such as the one we saw in the fall of 2008 and early 2009, instead of the parties using political work to promote the good of the country, the parties use the country to promote their own power and petty positions. The procedures that allow such abuse should be wrenched from them and replaced with those that are democratic and productive.
At the moment, facing the nation is the residue of a very bad era. The House and the Senate can introduce one or other of the tax cuts or both or do nothing. Bizarrely, even as electioneering propaganda the tax-cut agendas are very late in the day and likely to have unintended consequences.
Even if the government introduced tax cuts today, it will be too late for any feel good factor to get to the population or business and much less into the economic data before the elections in November. Even if the Administration's tax cuts for business was adopted it will fail in restoring confidence in the Administration before the elections and will be far too late to persuade the markets to hold off selling stocks.
The markets are not fooled by the administration's $50bn of stimulus to industry via infrastructure spending. They know it is not enough. The economists in the market who seriously want to repair the US economy are not fooled by the CNBC 'tax-cut' propaganda either because they know that all tax-cuts increase the national debt.
Therefore: whether the government applies tax cuts or does nothing: the markets will decline and crash September-November anyway and a double-dip recession (aka G Depression II) in the economy is likely to follow. The latter not primarily because of a market crash, but because the fundamental productive capacity of the economy is badly damaged and no branch of the government has started to restructure and rebuild it.
Hi , I have a few ideas ,, first I think that we need a flat tax accross the board that would make room to get rid of the IRS and that cost to run that huge monstrosoty. second dump the capital gains tax ,that would open up so much money that people hold on to and create spending ,thus create jobs and growth, I also think that the Goverment should inploy some the ideas of the founding fathers.like having some our seats being filled by people who want to repersent there areas not for a job but like some of the first gov paitrents did , with the idea that the seat would not be a full time job but just to have a seat in a gov office to make choices for the masses . Alot of those guys did not get a free ride to make choices they did it because they were citizens of a free land and loved it ,now adays they do whats best for their personal bottom line ,not for in most cases the masses this is greed and it has ruined GOV.TO MANY STICKY FINGERS !! Just my 2 cents..:-)
lol, nope.
Having read a number of the comments , the American people suffer from self mutilation! The emperical evidence has always shown an overwhelming high ratio of small business exceeds by far the employment by large corporations. Given the calamity brought on by big business and big banks plus the treasonist behaviour of Wall Street ... how can anyone in their right mind oppose the proposed small business incentive plan ? It boggles the mind to hear the political hatred blind individuals to logic and national wellbeing.
These delusionals burn the very flag they wrap themselves in. Sad . Sad . Sad !
How can you prpose ongoing "stimulus" when you are having to BORROW the money to establish it?
The debt load of the U.S. is astromomical. You cannot borrow your way out of debt.
The infrastructure repair was a decent idea back in its day when we did not have the infrastructure and were actually building it.
Now we are just paving a few roads and building up airport infrastructure. Who is going to be flying when everyone is broke and no one has a job?
Free the Constitution (Must be a radical I guess). Vote the bums out starting in November and continuing into 2012.
These politicians have been living in their little world so long that they do not know what is happening here in reality.
As I see it, the Obama plan is working perfectly. The plan layed out by the
Tri Lateral Commision, which handpicked and groomed Obama with the express purpose of
spending this country into bankrupcty so they can usher the USA into their One World Government.
The only hope is a clean election sweep of those now in The White House and those in Congress that
are pushing this discructive plan along...
I believe The Obama administration has made this promise of recovery almost a trillion dollars ago. Legislation was passed without being read in order to get the "healing" started as fast as possible.We all know what a disaster that has been. If our elected officials fall for this twice, then our country is doomed and we'll deserve it for being so gullible. There are some serious problems at play here, from the top down.
I don't think it will help, but it might cause another huge sucker rally once all the European problems get fixed tomorrow. Then on Friday all the European problems surface again and we go down again...
It's too late for the US. Too much debt. It's over. It may take at least a decade to recover. Government will have to shrink drastically and they must stop fighting pointless wars.
A double dip is a certainty. Check out the Consumer Metrics Institute Growth Index. It has dropped to almost the same low as in 2008. Three months later the stockmarket tanked.
Another great Idea from the folks who care.
The health care thing, the bail outs , the stimuli, this is an old marketing scheme.
First double the price, then give em half off???
The scam is becoming so obvious anymore I do not think it long before all the people see the man behind the curtain.
Trade what ya see, not what ya think.
Will it help? Short term maybe a little. Long term, definitely not. Unfortunately, US economic policies have painted the goverment into an impossible corner. Political expediancy has over-run economic capability.
This is a union payoff and impact if any, will not be felt until 2011. Why isn't unspent stimulus beige used for a payroll tax holiday which will hav an immediate effect across all sectors.
Stimulus on infrastructure makes sense. This is money that will likely save money in the long run due to the current downward pressure on cost. Roads, airports etc. need to be routinely maintained. Employment created by the upgrades, repair and maintenance of existing infrastructure is likely to reduce the unemployment claims, another saving. He is buying on sale what he is going to have to buy eventually and benefiting on the backside. Much of the monies will come back as a double swing, not having to pay out for unemployment benefits and receiving back tax money at both the individual and the business level.
The fed has spent enough...the U.S. debt is incomprehensibly huge... while I do agree that investing in our aging infrastructure and small businesses is needed... we just can't afford to add yet more to the debt.
Definitly yes ,this is the power of the vendoring and retailers that warms the engine of the economy .
Obama should fire his economic advisors. He probably won't as he picked people whose philosophy matches his. But as long as they "stimulate" unions and other key campaign contributors including those on Wall Street, and piling new regulations and hidden taxes and mandates on small businesses, new jobs will be a rarity. It just won't work until they change course--or, more likely, voters put new people into positions of power.
The stimulus:
1. Infrastructure: 50 Billion for roads, rails and airports.
2. Research credit
3. Tax deduction for new equipment
4. Mortgage relief
First of all, this is all too little too late. I thought it first before I heard many Republicans say this. The fact of the matter is almost two years have gone by with social and financial reform plans being front and center. These did nothing to stimulate small businesses and investors, the people that build this country. As a matter of fact, it went a long way toward making them very angry. If they want stimulus extend the Bush tax cuts for a number of years, just do it. All in all businesses see this as a way to get votes and kind of slimey.
First, infrustructure: this is just adding more money and spending to an already over blown spening initiative. it needs to be done but will only affect a very small number of businesses. But as mentioned, the Unions will love it.
Second, Research credit: This has been pushed by Bill Gates and Warren Buffett along with others. This has potential.
Third, tax deduction for new equipment: This has potential in the short run. If I needed equipment and could obtain a tax deduction for buying it this year I'd do it. But in November I'd remember the tricks of the Obama administration.
Forth, mortgage bail out: This is helping those who are too stupid to know any better. They are going to fall on their own spear sooner or later anyway. This further creates anger in those that are frugal and spits in their eye. Soon, those people will say enough is enough, let the idiots go down the toilet while those that are disciplined and frugal prosper. It also helps the Wall Street crowd that created the mess as loans held by Fannie and Freddie dont apply, which happens to be 90-95% of the housing market. What a waste!
All in all, an extension f tax cuts and certain repeals of Obamacare would jettison the marekt to new highs. But will the narsacist tax and spend politicians figure it out. Don't hold your breath.
I answered unsure because timing is really important. Much like King Canute the tide is everything. If the policy goes into place too soon, it will have little effect. If it is implemented after 2012 (potential Gann recovery point) it should have a large effect.
The President shouting in Milwaukee is taking on a greater similarity to Hitler every day...
The problem is that he is not in control...
The crooks in Wall street and Government in Washington are running him as their fool...
Is it surprising that he hasn't yet noticed?
Failure is written all over this thing.
The first stimulus failed; why add insult to injury? Spending will not save the US.
The mob in Washington is never actually doing what they report. They are deeply in the pockets of special interest groups. The bunch we have now are aligned with the unions and foreign groups with intention of manipulating the issues to enrich their sources of capital and power. The Bush bunch were also deep into special interest, just a different bunch and they were less willing to ruin our country than the current bunch. Crooks all who do not remember the love our forefathers lived and worked for our nation. I fear that if we do not go back to core values and uphold our Constitution, we are lost as a nation. We have the time and opportunity, are there any politicians who still care about the people?
Sincerely, Frank
It will provide only short term growth but may be adequate to sustain the economy until we can provide our own long term growth through need and innovation. Long term growth can only come about through the creation of new employment, not by providing stimulus money which will end at some point in time unless you keep adding more stimulus monies. New wealth has to be created to provide sustained economic growth.
Looks like a great opportunity to try to snare votes. The infrastructure related jobs will go to union members employed by a few big contractors.
With higher health care costs, higher taxes, and more regulation, why would any business hire? The economy is going no where as long as Obama is president. This is for the election only. Then, he resumes his anti business ways.
As long as higher health care mandates, higher taxes, and more regulation, why would any business hire? Our economy is going no where (but down?) while Obama is president.
It looks like a vote getter to me.
This article explains why talking about promoting small business is only to get votes. The impact of all the new bank regulations is only beginning to be felt, long term its going to add to the demographic push to the downside:
http://www2.dailyprogress.com/business/2010/sep/06/trailer-company-gets-financing-it-needed-ar-489527/
Andy
Obama's plans are too little too late. He's done nothing for Main Street the entire time he's been in office. He's been a puppet for the banks and big corporations who own Washington anyway. This whole administration has been such a fraud and it's a shame that the American people are so easily fooled. We need to shut this government down and just start over with the Constitution. Oh... I'm sorry! I can't talk about the Constitution! That makes me an extremist!
On the investment and capital growth side, it will have minimal effect if it's targeted at small business. Those businesses are still focused on paying off debt and not taking on new risk. Capital improvements will come from improved margins only. "Build it, and they will come" works only in the movies, and new products/innovation on a large scale. (Staying with the movie theme, think 24 screen mega-theatres with stadium seating in the 90's).
On the job growth side, it's better than census jobs, with higher pay and longer duration, but then what? What skills are those workers gaining that will be employed once those jobs end in 10 years?
Based on Obama's past history this is just more mislabeled spending. Twenty months ago he begged for the 700-800 billion stimulus which was suppose to be shovel ready job creators. Did it create jobs? NO! How is he proposing to pay for this new spending bill. Eliminate the Oil depletion allowance which will destroy jobs in that industry. The net job gain would be a loss in job. This latest proposal is just another union payoff at tax payers expense.
Every dollar the government spends comes from the private sector. The net outcome is destructive not "stimulative". Obummer is only interested in making record numbers reliant on government aid or a job to buy votes.
Obama's and Congress' "Health Care" will be very expensive and increase our debt. Obama' plans for infrastructure expenditures of dollars we don't have is only another form of stimulus. There is no doubt that some expenditure in this area is essential; however, we should be prepared to pay as we go without adding to the mountain of debt.
Obama plans to increase taxes next year. This will be counterproductive and will result in further slow down of the economy.
What is needed is a great reduction in the spending binge by governments at all levels in America. Then tax reductions and removal of over regulation to improve the business environment for business grown which would be boosted by added savings on the part of citizens to provide the funds to expand and improve companies.
Obama is looking for votes later this year and thus the sti,ulus. It might backfire on him anyway
simply it has to support, US can not afford to fall back passively in double recession
Some small business will get some benefits but most business that higher make over $250 K
his cut off point will not grow.
The roads will go to underdeveloped areas that will not generate much growth in the future
and we have been building lots of airport space from the last great stimulus. But who will travel when we have not jobs?
Almost all of the jobs go to UNION people not the people that will create jobs that are new and lasting.